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    TUHOKlimaticka zmena / Thank you so much for ruining my day
    DNF
    DNF --- ---
    SHEFIK: Kam az budes ochotny natahovat diskusi, aby sis obhajil spravnost svoji vize?

    Jsou to VSECHNA reseni ktera nalezi tem, kdo se pro reseni rozhodli. Pro kazdeho je jeho akce jeho resenim. Jsi snad diktator, abys vsem vnucoval spravne reseni? Vytahni si uz ty spunty z usi, a sundej zrcadlo z monitoru.

    Pokud te tvuj sales-vztek ze malo prodavas pohne k sales-akci, treba te, ze budes "vic nosit zlutou", ktera zvysi sales ... Je to spatne pouziti sales-vzteku?

    Proc pro tebe (a asi hlavne pro tebe) musi byt vztekem vyprovokovana akce taky vztekem provedena? Protoze si to jinak neumis predstavit? Chci ti pomoct...
    YMLADRIS
    YMLADRIS --- ---
    TADEAS: dopracovala jsem se od pozice jak bude blby az se dojde pres stale nove mutace a nereagujici vakciny k tomu, ze fakt je potreba delat #zerocovid opatreni a nektera uzemi to daji, zatimco CR neodvratne zustane na blbe strane tech zdi ...
    ... k pozici, ze teoreticky to muze byt pro klima dobry, protoze uzemi ktery bude chtit zvladnout #zerocovid, fakt uz nutne musi zacit naslouchat vedcum, inzenyrum, totalne zapojit technologie, socialni praci, prerozdelovani, obetave politiky ... a az zvladnou #zerocovid, snad ta infrastruktura spolecenska pomuze i na #under2degrees
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    DNF: jaky osobni emoce pletu?

    vzhledem k tomu, ze linkovana studie ma nadpis "Differential impacts of eco-anxiety, eco-depression, and eco-anger on climate action and wellbeing" a abstract je s tim v souladu, neni to uroven VSECH reseni, ktere ty zminujes.

    a to je to co jsem chtel zduraznit, a rekl jsem uz na zacatku "porovnani horsiho s horsim".

    to co rikam prece neni nic "meho". to ze se lovci sberaci ridili v diskuzich vic svymi emcoemi, nez rozumem, je fakt dolozeny ve spouste knizek. nebo se snazis vyvratit, ze je vhodnejsi pro oragnizovane plneni cilu na urovni lidstva jednat emocionalne? navic ja nerikam, ze bychom k reseni nedosli skrze emoce, co tvrdim a psal sem niz je, ze resit problemy emocionalne je suboptimalni a neni efektivni. shodneme se alespon na tomhle?

    stejne tak v businessu se emoce odlozi na urvoni nejake neformalni diskuze dopredu a pak se proste jedou fakta a racionalizovane uvahy. do smlouvy emoce, dojmy a pocity nepatri.

    na uplne nejjednodussim prikladu, predstav si, ze zavolas do firmy a nekdo by se tam svuj problem s tvym neporozumnenim snazil resit vztekem. dosli byste nejakemu zaveru?

    ja nerikam, ze vztek nema sve misto, ani nerikam, ze na urovni jednotlivce nepomuze s vyrvonanim se s nejakou situaci. co ale rikam je, ze globalni problem nevyresime vztekem. a ze existuji efektivnejsi formy, jak tohle lidstvo spolecne mobilizovat

    DNF
    DNF --- ---
    SHEFIK: No dovol, to snad rikaji podepsani vedci a australska data, proc do toho pletes nejaky osobni emoce? :)

    Studie rika je vetsi pravdepodobnost, ze s tim neco pujdes udelat, at individualne, nebo ve skupine. Zaroven to zlepsi tvoje spatne pocity.

    Ty rikas ze je to pravdive, a hned mas pred sebou nejake reseni, protoze ho vzapeti hodnotis jako neandrtalske. Ja mam na mysli vsechna reseni.

    Jako bonus to vysvetlim jeste jednou, at mam naskok: Mas na mysli nejake reseni ktere jasne plyne z eco-vzteku, a je spatne. Ale je to tvoje reseni vylihle jen ve tvoji hlave. Vzapeti ho nacpes do hlav vsech co diky eko-vzteku dosli k nejakemu jejich reseni.
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    DNF: vidis a me to prijde naopak

    ty rikas, ze vztek je dobry, aby se zacalo neco resit " je vetsi pravdepodobnost, ze s tim neco pujdes udelat, at individualne, nebo ve skupine. Zaroven to zlepsi tvoje spatne pocity."

    a ja rikam, ze tohle je sice pravdive, ale hrozne nebezpecne zjednoduseni. a vysvetlil jsem proc
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    #perspective .)

    Bill Gates: Solving Covid easy compared with climate
    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-56042029

    Solving climate change would be "the most amazing thing humanity has ever done", says the billionaire founder of Microsoft.

    By comparison, ending the pandemic is "very, very easy", he claims.
    DNF
    DNF --- ---
    SHEFIK: ani si neprecetl co ti pisu, a porad si meles svou. OK, rozumim.
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    biosfericka valka, politika jidla.

    pro mestske populace hure srozumitelne. fskutecnosti jde o kontrolu ekosystemu (kym, pro koho, jakymi praktikami?).

    bohuzel, vege-lidi tu sedaj na lep ty hruby korporatni masinerii :)


    Frederic Leroy
    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1361013338868711434.html

    Most have heard of @wef's 2021 #TheGreatReset or its earlier 2012 #GreatTransformation. Many are aware of #EATLancet's #GreatFoodTransformation. Few know #Tellus' #GreatTransition or #WBGU's #GreatTransformation. The similarities of the names aren't coincidental. All go back to an interrelated network of organizations, many of which were shaped by Maurice Strong in the '70-'90s. Strong was an oil businessman, New Ager, Rockefeller asset & UN protagonist. #TheGreatReset & its dietary part #TheGreatFoodTransformation are part of his legacy.

    Today, the post-Strong Great Transition/Transformation network is being mobilized for the UN #FoodSystems Summit. The aim: to change dietary policies worldwide. In addition, "vegan tech" (lab-grown foods) has joined the club, $$$-fueled by #SiliconValley investors (& others). Today, the post-Strong Great Transition/Transformation network is being mobilized for the UN #FoodSystems Summit. The aim: to change dietary policies worldwide. In addition, "vegan tech" (lab-grown foods) has joined the club, $$$-fueled by #SiliconValley investors (& others). The policies coming from this Summit likely will be *highly* interventionist, as the #GreatFoodTransformation is an authoritarian one.



    It has come to the following: a strategic partnership between the @UN and the transnational corporate elites of Davos' @wef. Maurice Strong would have loved it! What could go wrong? The "Big Plan for a Small Planet" (& its zillion versions of public-private partnerships) is ready to take off in 2021.

    ...

    Presenting JUNK FOOD as a way to save the planet in the face of a massive fossil fuel challenge, & the fact that it is presented as such by academics, journalists, & even the UN, is going to be seen as one of the biggest absurdities of the early 21st century
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    dovolim si jednu citaci. fear is the power of the dark side, fear leads to hate, hate leads to suffering .)

    vztek totiz mozna posune tebe a uvede te do akce, ale skrze obvinovani "tech ostatnich", kteri se budou nevyhnutelne branit. a ty sam klimatickej problem nevyresis, protoze "oni" jsou take soucasti problemu, resp. i jeho reseni
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    DNF: tohle je nezavisle na "eco". je to obecne lidske chovani, tahle studie nic noveho do psychologie, nebo teorie reseni problemu neprinasi

    pokud prijmeme premisu, ze vztek nam pomuze resit problemy, tak je sice budeme resit, ale efektivitou tlup na urovni lovcu-sberacu.

    je to suboptimalni reseni problemu. a nejde o to, jestli se to vyhroti do riotu nebo ne. kdyz od nekoho neco chces (zapojit vsechny lidi k reseni problemu), pokud nejsi diktator a zijes v demokratickych hodnotach, tak se vztekem moc posouvat nebudes.

    tohle je totiz taky vedecky overeny. proto vznikl obor diplomacie, kde vztek nema misto
    DNF
    DNF --- ---
    SHEFIK: Nehledate v tom nejak moc vyznamu? Coz by svedcilo spis o emocnim chapani nez technickem.

    O cem to mluvi je, ze pokud mas eko-vztek, je vetsi pravdepodobnost, ze s tim neco pujdes udelat, at individualne, nebo ve skupine. Zaroven to zlepsi tvoje spatne pocity. Oproti tomu jine eko-rozpolozeni maji tendenci opacnou. To rikaji vedci. Eko-vztek je spoustec vlastniho zapojeni, ze akce budou rioty tam nikde napsano neni, ale asi to malokdo cetl, jako obvykle :)

    Akce podle nich znamena i posunuti vlastniho chovani smerem k eko-uvedomelemu chovani. Oh, jak se ti ekoteroriste nechavaji unaset emocemi!

    Navic to ukazuje, ze vsechno to "to je spatnej pristup, lidi tim akorat nastvou" mozna neni zas tak marna stretegie, naopak, koho se podari eko-nastvat, je z toho jednou nohou venku!
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    Blair Fix
    https://twitter.com/blair_fix/status/1361121548493594628/photo/1

    I've made thousands of charts, but this remains one of my favorites: the labor time to construct a power plant scales tightly with plant capacity.

    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    YMLADRIS: ale to ne. jednak nejde je nemit a jednak je spatne je potlacovat. ale jedna vec je nechat se jimi unaset a druha bejt si jich vedom, vyuzivat je ve svuj prospech, ale nenechavat je prevladnout na ukor usudku

    je to tu asi offtopic, ale proc sem regoval bylo, ze to z tech novych studii co tadeas a tuho linkovali, ze nejlepsim resenim klimatickyho problemu je vztek. pokud bych si tohle dal opravdu do rovnice a prijmul do dusledku "reseni = vztek", pak se z kazdyho druhyho stane agresor a budeme tu mit klimatickej riot. kterej samozrejme problem nevyresi, nadela tech problemu daleko vic, vcetne polarizace spolecnosti, a to je to nejvic vzdaleny reseni, co muze bejt. protoze na zachranu klima je potreba idealne kazdyho cloveka, ne pulku lidstva odradit.

    nejsem si jistej, jestli se mi to dari spravne vysvetlit, ale pokud znam sam sebe, vim jaky flow emoci mam, vim take (mam zkusenosti z minulosti, pokud mi neni 15), jak ho uridit a pak je jedno jestli jde o klima nebo jiny existencionalni problem. kdyz to generalizuju - bud muzu prekonavat svuj strach agresi (cimz ho nikdy neprekonem, jen prekryju), nebo zpocatku pujdu mene prijemnou akceptaci, cimz se sice dostavam na hranu uzkosti, nicmene racionalizaci muzu uridit konstruktivni cestu k reseni.

    muzu to jeste rict i bussinesove :) mam nejaky problem. vezmu metodiku Lean six sigma, na optimalizaci lidskych procesu a postupuju tak, abych ho vyresil. nastavim si konkretni cil a rozdelim si ho na dilci, realizovatelne v urcitem case, aby me nesemlela uzkost jeho nedosazitelnosti. pak se muzu divat na to, jestli sem dosah milniku nebo ne a vidim za sebou progress. ta emoce zustava maximalne pri uvedomneni problemu, dal uz ne, protoze
    vim, ze delam maximum co je v mych moznostech abych cile dosahl.
    YMLADRIS
    YMLADRIS --- ---
    SHEFIK: sometimes in my tears i drown but I never let it get me down
    So when negativity surrounds I know some day it'll all turn around

    ted nejak to bude dva roky co jsem pochopila klima. ty to pises, jako by si clovek mohl vybrat jestli emoce bude mit, nebo ne :)
    SEJDA
    SEJDA --- ---
    Elon Musk spolu s X-Prize vypsali odmenu 100 mil. USD tomu, kdo jako prvni zachyti 1 t uhliku za den (do roku 2025) s tim, ze se jeho reseni bude dat ekonomicky smysluplne rozsirit na zachycovani 1 Gt uhliku za rok (do roku 2050).

    https://www.xprize.org/prizes/elonmusk#prize-activity

    "The world's leading scientists estimate that we may need to remove as much as 6 gigatons of CO2 per year by 2030, and 10 gigatons per year by 2050 to avoid the worst effects of climate change. For humanity to reach the Paris Agreements goal of limiting the Earth’s temperature rise to no more than 1.5˚(C) of pre-industrial levels, or even 2˚(C), we need bold, radical tech innovation and scale up that goes beyond limiting CO2 emissions, but actually removes CO2 already in the air and oceans. If humanity continues on a business-as-usual path, the global average temperature could increase 6˚(C) by the year 2100.

    This four-year global competition invites innovators and teams from anywhere on the planet to create and demonstrate solutions that can pull carbon dioxide directly from the atmosphere or oceans ultimately scaling massively to gigaton levels, locking away CO2 permanently in an environmentally benign way.

    Solutions will be scientifically evaluated across multiple criteria such as; amount of CO2 removed, life cycle analysis of the removal process, energy efficiency, land footprint and sequestration capabilities.

    Any carbon negative solution is eligible: nature-based, direct air capture, oceans, mineralization, or anything else that sequesters CO2 permanently. "
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    Commercial Carbon Capture And Use Takes A Step Forward With Carbon Clean
    https://www.forbes.com/...on-capture-and-use-takes-a-step-forward-with-carbon-clean/?sh=4206d48a6a47

    UK-headquartered Carbon Clean is working on different approaches to reaching net zero, including CCS, ICCU, biomethane amongst others and, according to the company, has so far removed over 800,000 tonnes of CO2 from its 38 facilities around the world. Aniruddha Sharma, CEO of Carbon Clean, said: “CEMEX shares our mission to enable the net zero transition by developing affordable modularized carbon capture solutions. This latest grant from the US Government endorses the importance of such work.”
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    SHEFIK: me emoce vztahujici se k eoosystemu umoznuji resit problem pro me dobrou cestou
    SHEFIK
    SHEFIK --- ---
    TADEAS: konstruktivni reseni problemu prece ze svy podstaty problem akceptuje a je kontradikci jak ignorance, tak nezajmu

    co sebsnazim rict je, ze emoce, jakekoliv nam brani resit problem optimalni cestou. zpusobuji vlny dalsich emoci a reakci, kterym se pak vsichni venuji vic nez problemu samotnemu.
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    SHEFIK: dobrej eko-pocit predikuje eco-ignorance a eco-disinterest
    TADEAS
    TADEAS --- ---
    Paul Maidowski
    https://twitter.com/_ppmv/status/1360933540708368384?s=19

    It's a vital problem for our societies that job-hunting—or any kind of career-building for people who aren't tenured professor or otherwise secure / well established—doesn't rhyme with working on systemic risks & limits to growth.

    ...

    Who will keep societies honest, & develop solutions, if it's mostly retired elderly diplomats, engineers & senior scientists (& of course many activists etc), but not *career-building & powerful people* call out the obvious truths & fundamental contradictions we must resolve now?

    ...

    The incentives in societies, most direcly in the job market & in professional hierarchies, are wrong & self-destructive. Hard to see how people hope to solve deeper problems if we get penalized for calling them out.

    This needs to change—if we want livable futures
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